Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

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Cool Breeze
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Re: Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

Post by Cool Breeze »

The idiot is so clueless that in reality (and yes we help people with medicines if they need treatment) by far the best thing to do, or to have done, is precisely that - nothing. For this reason, states with lower jabs overall and no requirements of the stuff that doesn't work (masks, lockdowns) have better numbers in hospitalizations and infections (best example is FL). The data shows that all of the measures any government took, along these lines, in any given place hurt people. But what does Bish care about data? Another example, YET another of his lies and ignorance of what actually goes on in life. But I expect he'll keep talking about people in colors and ironically, tribes - because that's their thing - accuse you of what they do. So again, the reality is, Bobby Bish hurts people by his stupid policies (and what about jobs/drugs/alcohol) and he hurts them 100-fold compared to the people he claims are foolish or don't care about others. This kind of denial of reality is typical of the idiot leftist.

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Bob Butler
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Liar Cool Breeze?

Post by Bob Butler »

Cool Breeze wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:58 am
The idiot is so clueless that in reality (and yes we help people with medicines if they need treatment) by far the best thing to do, or to have done, is precisely that - nothing. For this reason, states with lower jabs overall and no requirements of the stuff that doesn't work (masks, lockdowns) have better numbers in hospitalizations and infections (best example is FL). The data shows that all of the measures any government took, along these lines, in any given place hurt people. But what does Bish care about data? Another example, YET another of his lies and ignorance of what actually goes on in life. But I expect he'll keep talking about people in colors and ironically, tribes - because that's their thing - accuse you of what they do. So again, the reality is, Bobby Bish hurts people by his stupid policies (and what about jobs/drugs/alcohol) and he hurts them 100-fold compared to the people he claims are foolish or don't care about others. This kind of denial of reality is typical of the idiot leftist.
Taking a vaccine, masks, and similar precautions are effective according to the science. I do not recall having pressed a policy about jobs, drugs or alcohol as regards to Covid, though off the cuff I's say that recreational drugs and alcohol can easily be overdone by anyone, and taking precautions against Covid is sensible when possible. Covid is equally harmful to any tribe as far as I know.

(Edit. I do remember a little reporting that Native Americans were getting poor Covid treatment a while back, which could be tribal thinking if you stretch it.)

I would say ignoring the science and precautions would be a typical denial of reality common among the anti vaxers.

I would say in this post at least, Cool Breeze has shown a tendency to make up lies when dealing with a political opponent, almost as blatant as John. I don't particularly recommend this, as you never know when either is doing it, when they are spouting a lie. Their writings just can't be trusted.

tim
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Re: Liar Cool Breeze?

Post by tim »

Bob Butler wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 7:04 pm
Taking a vaccine, masks, and similar precautions are effective according to the science.
Whose "science" are we talking about here? Can you honestly say that you know 100% what the vaccine does and its complete mechanism of action it has on the human body? No, you can't. What you can do is repeat statements and information from the government and big pharma.

You, as an individual, can't prove anything regarding the vaccine. You can attempt to make an argument of correlation of news articles and statistics that may be skewed by the media but you can't say "the science is settled".

Here is an interesting article making claims that the vaccine destroys the innate immune system by reprogramming how it works. Is this true? I don't know. Can I prove what the article is saying? No, but I will be conservative and not get the vaccine because I am not comfortable with how they say it works. As someone who had COVID-19 my choice was right for me as I recovered just fine at home with no lasting effects.

https://www.ukcolumn.org/article/stabil ... o9Dt8Rq79w
Summary
Changes to key parts of the mRNA code in SARS-CoV-2 vaccines may be causal in changing the innate immune response via toll-like receptors. Toll-like receptors are important components in defence against infection and downstream effects may also include inhibition of CD8 T cell response. CD8 is a vital part of the immune system’s ability to eradicate infection and cancer. Those changes may be reflected in recent reactivated Varicella Zoster infections although specific mechanisms are unclear at the moment. Anecdotal reports of significant uptick in cancer presenting to medical consultants may be consistent with aberrant toll-like receptor and dendritic cell changes leading to an inhibition of the anti-cancer CD8 effector response. Further data are required but the prospect of an altered CD8 response to infection and cancer is very concerning and should prompt urgent investigation.
In life and in science, changes have consequences. With hindsight, the bad ones are easy to see, some may argue. But when we examine the natural consequences of changes in the arena of Covid vaccine science, one might be forgiven for asking: surely someone must have cautioned against doing that? Of course it behoves us to state here, before we examine those consequences: that’s why new drug/vaccine products are supposed to be thoroughly tested before they are given to large populations.
“Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; - Exodus 20:5

tim
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Re: Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

Post by tim »

Check out this example of "the science is settled":

https://www.sv40foundation.org/cpv-link/
There was a problem, however, with using these monkey kidney cells to both create the original vaccine strains and grow the vaccine in large quantities. Monkeys contain simian viruses.[11] When the poliovirus was passaged through the monkeys or grown on the monkey kidney cells for production, extraneous viruses became part of the final poliovirus vaccine.[12] As early as 1953, Dr. Herald R. Cox, a scientist working at Lederle Laboratories, one of the polio vaccine manufacturers, published an article in a peer reviewed scientific journal in which he stated, “[P]oliomyelitis virus has so far been cultivated only in the tissues of certain susceptible species—namely, monkey or human tissues. Here again we would always be confronted with the potential danger of picking up other contaminating viruses or other microbic agents infectious for man.”[13] In fact, in 1958, a scientific journal reported that “the rate of isolation of new simian viruses (from monkey kidney cells) has continued unabated.”[14] Additionally, in 1960, the pharmaceutical company Merck & Co. wrote to the U.S. Surgeon General:

Our scientific staff have emphasized to us that there are a number of serious scientific and technical problems that must be solved before we could engage in large-scale production of live poliovirus vaccine. Most important among these is the problem of extraneous contaminating simian viruses that may be extremely difficult to eliminate and which may be difficult if not impossible to detect at the present stage of the technology.[15]
“Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; - Exodus 20:5

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Bob Butler
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Science and Conspiracy Theories

Post by Bob Butler »

On the polio vaccine, we remember the polio disease and how it was cured. We don’t remember any side infections. This does not say there weren’t any, but the benefit clearly outweighed the defeating of the disease.

If you have a political worldview, you have a political temptation to invent weird conspiracy theories which seemingly have to do with the science which actually are created for political purposes. This doesn’t suggest not researching fully. Neither does it suggest that all conspiracy theories are true, that whenever someone attempts to cure a disease the attempt should be crushed politically.

Trump’s attempts to insure reelection by killing Americans was not America’s finest hour. Murder has become a Republican policy. Talk to me about something that has been shown to exist. Suggest a way around it. Don’t just advocate death for death’s sake.

tim
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Re: Science and Conspiracy Theories

Post by tim »

Bob Butler wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:22 pm
On the polio vaccine, we remember the polio disease and how it was cured. We don’t remember any side infections. This does not say there weren’t any, but the benefit clearly outweighed the defeating of the disease.
The vaccine did not cure the disease all it did was introduce simian viruses into people that caused cancer.

Image

Like the mRNA shots that were suppose to stop COVID-19 but here we are with more deaths in 2021 then in 2020.

Also, Omicron variant is hitting the vaxxed:

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/most-r ... 021-12-10/
Most of the 43 COVID-19 cases caused by the Omicron variant identified in the United States so far were in people who were fully vaccinated, and a third of them had received a booster dose, according to a U.S. report published on Friday.
“Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; - Exodus 20:5

tim
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Re: Science and Conspiracy Theories

Post by tim »

Bob Butler wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:22 pm
Trump’s attempts to insure reelection by killing Americans was not America’s finest hour. Murder has become a Republican policy. Talk to me about something that has been shown to exist. Suggest a way around it. Don’t just advocate death for death’s sake.
Your perception of reality and the world is strange and I don't understand it.

I imagine this is an example of how America is divided.

I will not give in to the left.

So where do we go from here? Are we going to unite to fight together against the Chinese or is Civil War II inevitable?
“Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; - Exodus 20:5

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Bob Butler
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Re: Science and Conspiracy Theories

Post by Bob Butler »

tim wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:38 pm
Bob Butler wrote:
Mon Dec 13, 2021 2:22 pm
Trump’s attempts to insure reelection by killing Americans was not America’s finest hour. Murder has become a Republican policy. Talk to me about something that has been shown to exist. Suggest a way around it. Don’t just advocate death for death’s sake.
Your perception of reality and the world is strange and I don't understand it.

I imagine this is an example of how America is divided.

I will not give in to the left.

So where do we go from here? Are we going to unite to fight together against the Chinese or is Civil War II inevitable?
From your chart above, I see that shortly after the vaccines were introduced, polio vanished. You see this as justification for a conspiracy theory which I do not see. It is one thing to generate a conspiracy theory. It is another to find evidence for it.

I do see this as evidence of division. I believe you will cling to your belief in your political values and conspiracy theories beyond all fact, evidence and reason.

This does not mean the minority will remain relevant. In past crises, the solutions to the problems of the time eventually become obvious. Yorktown. Appomatix. Hiroshima. Those who insist on the old values and not solving problems fade. If so, no second civil war. No China war. Covid defeated. Prejudice, oppression and racial violence reduced. You are making predictions that depend on people following Industrial Age behavior patterns. If your devout following of obsolete values holds, you will be like the militant strong on defense Republicans of the last high, cursing FDR even as they adapt his policy of containing expansionist autocrats.

As long as you cling to old values, there is not much to do but wait for the new to triumph. The remnant question is how many people the Republican policies will kill.

FullMoon
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Re: Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

Post by FullMoon »

Tim, you are correct in your assessment. But fear not. The structure of their belief system will fall away during the hard times. There's absolutely nothing to it, just listen to this drivel. But after the war, how can we possibly rebuild as before with such ingrained differences? Maybe with enough loss and suffering we can learn to forget. Bob is just a cheerleader for driving us full speed into our Doom. But he can't see it.

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Bob Butler
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Don't Solve Problems

Post by Bob Butler »

Believe it or not, there are people who will cling to problems, who will refuse to solve them in favor of staying the same. Prejudice, death, collapse, insurrection, failed environment, violence... All are considered really neat if they block the new way of thinking.

But as I said, it becomes obvious if you wait long enough.

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