Religion / Theology

Topics related to theology.
Navigator
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Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Navigator »

1 Even now, the Lord, Jehovah of Hosts,
deprives Judea and Jerusalem
of both staff and crutch—
all food supply and water supply,

Besides reflecting the historical origins of Isaiah’s prophecy, the names “Judea” and “Jerusalem” function as codenames of Jehovah’s end-time people, as noted (cf. Isaiah 1:1; 2:1). The title “Jehovah of Hosts” connotes Jehovah’s power and authority in implementing covenant curses now coming upon his people. The basic necessities they have so long taken for granted peter out as their circumstances change for the worse. The people’s “staff and crutch”—their livelihood, communal structure, and civic leadership (vv 1-3)—crumble away as their society spirals into anarchy and chaos (vv 4-7).

2 the valiant man and soldier,
the magistrate and prophet, the augur and elder,
3 the officer and dignitary,
advisers, skilled craftsmen, and orators.

Wisdom and knowledge, the backbone of a society, disappear as moral degeneracy supplants moral integrity. Accomplished individuals decrease and principled persons are marginalized as people turn selfish and hedonistic. In the end, law and order break down, commerce declines, and people fall prey to society’s lowest elements. When those who hold communities together, whose duty is to safeguard against corruption, become corrupt themselves, a nation disintegrates from within. A common denominator in such cases is Jehovah’s people forgetting their God (Isaiah 17:10-11).

4 I, Jehovah, will make adolescents their rulers;
delinquents will lord it over them.

Although God gave humanity the freedom to choose good or evil in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 2:16-17), once a person chooses he isn’t free to decide the consequences. Likewise, when Jehovah’s people choose evil, evil aftereffects unavoidably follow. So it is with their leadership. As the people do, so do their leaders; and vice versa. Spiritually immature and profligate persons—“adolescents” and “delinquents”—end up governing their affairs, bringing the nation to ruin. Relying on their own wisdom instead of on Jehovah’s, their darkened minds can’t foresee the end result of their nefarious handiwork.

5 People will oppress one another,
every man his neighbor.
The young will be insolent to the elderly,
the vile to the honorable.

When people no longer have confidence in their leaders—when things go awry because no one seeks guidance from God—they turn on each other out of exasperation (cf. Isaiah 9:21; 19:2; 54:15). As Jehovah withdraws his Spirit, the spirits of demons overcome them. A mood of contention takes over and society fragments into disparate elements. Isaiah’s paralleling “the young” and “the vile” implies that the rising generation has turned base. As the latter assume they are every bit as wise and intelligent as the older generation, the practice of showing deference or respect becomes unknown.

6 Then will a man apprehend a kinsman
of his father’s house, and say,
You have a tunic: be our leader
and take charge of this ruination!

The ultimate phase of a discordant society is a state of “ruination” or “total breakdown” (maksela). At that point, as law and order and its enforcement become nonexistent, people band together into clans for self-protection. Where even a semblance of leadership once existed, now there is anarchy. Where structure and civilization were the rule, now there is chaos. Under those circumstances, out of desperation people take hold of a person who formerly held office—a government official, a judge, a police officer, a soldier, a clerk, or even a mailman—and pressure him to deliver them from their plight.

7 But he will raise his hand in that day
and swear, I am no physician.
There is neither food nor clothing in my house;
you cannot make me a leader of the people.

Instead of raising his hand and swearing allegiance to accept his oath of office, the person now raises his hand to disavow it. In fact, by omitting the word “hand”—although the verb “raise” implies it—Isaiah makes the person’s renunciation of his office a parody of his former acceptance of it. That he is no “physician” or “healer” (hobes) alludes to the pathological state of people who have no access to remedial resources. Such deprivation—including the lack of food and clothing—suggests that a prolonged covenant curse has taken effect, rendering the collapsed society incapable of recovery.

8 Jerusalem will falter and Judea fall
because their tongue and their actions
are contrary to Jehovah,
an affront to his glory before his very eyes.

Those who “falter” or “stumble” (kasla) and “fall” (napal) are the wicked (Isaiah 8:14-15; 10:4; 28:13; 54:15; 59:10), not the righteous. These terms associate the reprobate of Jehovah’s people with Isaiah’s Babylon category, as it is they who stumble and fall, not Zion (Isaiah 13:15, 19; 14:4, 12; 21:9). Isaiah’s paralleling his people’s “tongue” and “actions” shows their interrelationship: when one is evil, so is the other. The word tongue additionally serves as a pseudonym of the king of Assyria/Babylon, whom the wicked emulate in speaking evil before God (Isaiah 9:17; 32:6-7; 37:23; 57:4; 59:3).

9 The look on their faces betrays them:
they flaunt their sin like Sodom;
they cannot hide it.
Woe to their souls;
they have brought disaster upon themselves!

The further mention of Sodom (cf. Isaiah 1:9-10) implies that sodomy has become widespread among Jehovah’s people. So much that it is flaunted openly and shows in his people’s faces and demeanor. Jehovah’s response is to pronounce a covenant curse: “Woe to their souls”—that is, to both body and spirit. The word “disaster” or “calamity” (ra‘a) alludes to Jehovah’s Day of Judgment, when he commissions the king of Assyria/Babylon to wreak a Sodom-and-Gomorrah type of destruction on the wicked of his people—on all who belong to Isaiah’s Babylon category (Isaiah 10:5-6; 13:1-19; 47:11).

10 Tell the righteous it shall be well with them;
they shall eat the fruits of their own labors.

To indicate that all isn’t gloom and doom—while at the same time inferring how few righteous people remain when compared to the wicked—Isaiah inserts a single, hopeful line. Elsewhere, he predicts that the righteous who keep faith with Jehovah through troubled times (Isaiah 26:1-3; 33:6) are gathered to safety before calamity strikes (Isaiah 13:3; 57:1). The term “well” or “good” (tob) connotes covenant blessings, suggesting that those who keep the terms of Jehovah’s covenant, who have laid up “the fruits of their own labors” for the evil day, enjoy sufficiency even as others starve (cf. v 7).

11 But woe to the wicked
when calamity overtakes them:
they shall be paid back
for the deeds they have done!

This verse completes a chiasm, consisting of covenant curse (v 9)—a1; covenant blessing (v 10)—b; and covenant curse (v 11)—a2. The antithetical nature of this mini-structure adds perspective to the relationship between good and evil, contrasting the consequences of righteousness and wickedness. Besides synonymously identifying the subject of verse 9 with “the wicked” of verse 11, it defines “disaster” and “calamity” as “the fruits of their own labors”—this time of the wicked, not of the righteous. Once the righteous are gathered out from among the wicked, the wicked suffer calamity (Isaiah 57:1).

12 As for my people, babes subject them;
women wield authority over them.
O my people, your leaders mislead you,
abolishing your traditional ways.

By using the covenant formula “my people . . . my people” (cf. Exodus 6:7; Leviticus 26:12; Isaiah 51:16), Jehovah shows that he seeks to reclaim his people to the very last from their corrupt condition. While the parallel terms “babes” and “women” may be intended literally, they undoubtedly convey a caricature of men who are spiritually immature or less than men in their personal lives. Their oppressive leadership in “misleading” Jehovah’s people—“abolishing” well-proven principles and established guidelines—causes their society to disintegrate, leaving them vulnerable to disaster (Isaiah 9:16-19).

13 Jehovah will take a stand and contend with them;
he has arisen to judge the nations.

This verse forms the centerpiece of another chiastic mini-structure: the “leaders” of “my people” (v 12)—a1; the “nations” (v 13)—b; the “elders” and “rulers” of “his people” (v 14)—a2. This tells us that Jehovah’s people, together with their leaders, elders, and rulers whom Jehovah is addressing, are now—in an end-time context—dispersed among all nations. Like a judge who takes the stand, Jehovah is coming to put them on trial, to condemn those who, instead of serving his people by equitably managing their affairs, despicably serve themselves (Isaiah 1:23-24; 10:1-4; 28:14-18; 32:5-7).

14 He will bring to trial the elders of his people
and their rulers, and say to them,
It is you who have devoured the vineyard;
you fill your houses by depriving the needy.

By again using the covenant formula “his people,” Jehovah shows his intent to care for his people in spite of their leaders’ lack of care. The term’s parallel occurrence with the “needy” denotes Jehovah’s regard for the oppressed. They, above all others—not the elite who wield authority over them—are “his people” (cf. v 15). Whereas the wealthy and powerful fall prey to pride, the needy’s lowly circumstances keep them humble. The “vineyard” their leaders devour—by feeding on their taxes and tithes—represents Jehovah’s covenant people, those whom Jehovah chooses as his own (Isaiah 5:7).

15 What do you mean by oppressing my people,
humbling the faces of the poor?
says Jehovah of Hosts.

By again paralleling “my people” with the “poor” or “needy” (‘aniyyim) (cf. v 14), Jehovah claims them in a special sense as his own. They constitute a major portion of his covenant people whom he delivers from destruction in his Day of Judgment: “You were a refuge for the poor, a shelter for the needy in distress, a covert from the downpour and shade from the heat. When the blasts of tyrants beat down like torrents against a wall, or like scorching heat in the desert, you quelled the onslaughts of the heathen: as burning heat by the shade of a cloud, you subdued the power of tyrants” (Isaiah 25:4-5).

16 Jehovah says, moreover,
Because the women of Zion are haughty
and put on airs, painting their eyes,
ever flirting when they walk
and clacking with their feet,

After admonishing the men for their crimes of injustice and idolatry (vv 12-15; Isaiah 1:17, 23; 2:6-22), Jehovah addresses the women. Sacrificing their feminine virtue and natural dignity, they obsess on the physical at the expense of the spiritual. In their attempts to please men, they contrive ways to attract their attention instead of placing their confidence in God. That these are “women of Zion” signifies that they—like the faithful city that becomes a harlot (Isaiah 1:21)—may once have belonged to Isaiah’s Zion/Jerusalem category, but instead of ascending further spiritually they have descended.

17 my Lord will afflict the scalps
of the women of Zion with baldness;
Jehovah will expose their private parts.

Inasmuch as the women of Zion seek to woo the men by using a façade of beauty—exposing intimate body parts in order to appeal to men’s baser instincts—in his Day of Judgment Jehovah exposes their intimate parts ad nauseam, entirely stripping away their exterior of glamour to reveal their debased interior. Covenant curses, such as baldness and a lack of clothing (vv 7, 24), show that Zion’s profligate women incur Jehovah’s judgments as do the men: “Be alarmed, you complacent women; be perturbed, O careless daughters! Strip yourselves bare; put sackcloth around your waists” (Isaiah 32:11).

18 In that day my Lord will strip away their finery—the anklets, head ornaments and crescents, 19 the pendants, chains and scarves, 20 tiaras, bracelets and ribbons, zodiac signs and charm amulets, 21 the rings, the noselets, 22 the elegant dress, the shawl, the kerchief and the purse, 23 hosiery, sheer linen, millinery, and cloaks.
24 And instead of perfume there shall be a stench,
instead of the girdle, a piece of twine,
instead of the coiffure, baldness,
instead of the festive dress, a loincloth of burlap;
for in place of beauty
there shall be ignominy

To press home the extremes to which Zion’s women go to beautify themselves, Isaiah presents an entire inventory of garnishments well-to-do women bring to bear—twenty-one, or three times seven. “In that day”—Jehovah’s Day of Judgment—the adornments they displayed are conspicuously absent as female excesses turn into utter deprivation and these women are confronted with relying solely on Jehovah. In a great reversal of circumstances, he humbles those who exalt themselves and exalts those who humble themselves (Isaiah 47:1-3; 52:1-3), whose lives the rich might have blessed.

25 Your men shall be felled by the sword,
your might overthrown in war.

Besides anarchy and internal collapse (vv 5-7), enemy invasion afflicts Jehovah’s people. Zion’s women lose their men, their providers and protectors. Didn’t Jehovah warn his people beforehand that if they didn’t repent they would “be eaten by the sword” (Isaiah 1:20; emphasis added)—the king of Assyria/Babylon? But they ignored him: “I will destine you to the sword; all of you shall succumb to the slaughter. For when I called, you did not respond; when I spoke, you would not give heed. You did what was evil in my eyes; you chose to do what was not my will” (Isaiah 65:12; emphasis added).

26 Her gateways shall lie bereaved and forlorn;
she shall sit on the ground destitute.

Jehovah’s wife who has played the harlot finds herself bereft of her divine provider and protector. Like a widow in mourning, she sits on the ground grieving at the loss of her sons (v 25). Commerce ceases as her ports of call lack traffic: “Havoc remains in the city; the gates lie battered to ruin” (Isaiah 24:12). Self-centered instead of God-centered, she suffers the fate of Isaiah’s Babylon category: “Bereavement and widowhood shall suddenly overtake you, both in one day” (Isaiah 47:9). Left destitute—a covenant curse—Jehovah’s people must learn the hard way from whence their blessings come.

Cool Breeze
Posts: 1791
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Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Cool Breeze »

Merry Christmas!

This sounds like a universal message and warning to those in decline = similar things happen to all people who forget (don't remember) the one true God and what we are called to do as part of His assembly. In that sense, isn't this just a cycle of GD?

John
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Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Cambridge, MA USA
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Re: Religion / Theology

Post by John »

** 25-Dec-2021 World View: Isaiah 17:1-3 and the destruction of Damascus

One of the most interesting parts of Isaiah is Isaiah 17:1-3, which
predicts the destruction of Damascus:
> "1 The oracle concerning Damascus. "Behold, Damascus
> is about to be removed from being a city And will become a fallen
> ruin. 2 "The cities of Aroer are forsaken; They will be for flocks
> to lie down in, And there will be no one to frighten them. 3 "The
> fortified city will disappear from Ephraim, And sovereignty from
> Damascus And the remnant of Aram; They will be like the glory of
> the sons of Israel," Declares the LORD of hosts."
Over the years, several people have written to me about this, to ask
whether it means that Damascus is going to be destroyed by a nuclear
bomb -- by Israel, by Iran, by Russia, by China, or by someone else.

One of the most complex comments that I received on this subject was
from a web site reader in February 2011, in response to my article
about the start of the "Arab Awakening" in Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, and
other countries:
> "I feel you are off in a few points. The biggest
> problem is you do not address the Bible's predictions in your
> assessments of a world conflict. As the Bible sees it, we shall
> have a limited war in the Middle East (Psalm 83/Isaiah 17/Jeremiah
> 49) that will involve Israel vs. Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt and
> Saudi Arabia. This war will end with Israel 'nuking' Damascus off
> the map and the world CRYING for a peace plan. With the inner ring
> of Arab nations conquered by Israel the Middle East problems will
> be seen as over, a 'new' global leader will provide a seven year
> treaty that makes more war impossible. Though when everyone says
> 'peace and safety', the end comes quickly. In 2-3 months I think,
> Russia and Iran and the outer ring of Arab nations will attack
> Israel in revenge (with Russia adding their might, but planning to
> double-cross the Arabs once things are done). ... As Ezekiel
> 38-39 reads God will supernaturally save Israel, and leave but
> 1/6th of its attackers alive."
The person who made these predictions ten years ago would undoubtedly
change many of the details today. Such are the dangers of trying to
make predictions, especially about the future. But one thing that
this commenter would almost certainly leave unchanged is the "nuking"
of Damascus.

Almost everyone in the Mideast seems to know about this prophecy. So
if anybody actually DOES drop a bomb on Damascus at some time in the
future, it will truly be a self-fulfilling prophecy, since the
attacker will certainly justify this action by saying it's a Bible
prophecy. Thus, it would be possible to argue that the CAUSE of the
nuclear attack on Damascus would have been the Bible prophecy. This
is ANOTHER danger of making predictions about the future -- someone
may make it his business to bring the prediction to pass.

Incidentally, the destruction of Damascus doesn't have to be from a
nuclear bomb. I'm thinking of the catastrophic seaport explosion in
Beirut on August 4, 2020 that leveled thousands of homes, killed and
injured thousands of people, and left 300,000 people homeless. Beirut
was, and still is, a city in ruins. That massive explosion was from
thousands of tonnes of ammonium nitrate that had been left in the port
since 2013. It is considered to be the greatest non-nuclear explosion
in history.

User avatar
Tom Mazanec
Posts: 3406
Joined: Sun Sep 21, 2008 12:13 pm

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Tom Mazanec »

It may be the 6th greatest accidental non-nuclear explosion in history, but I believe Minor Scale was the largest artificial (not volcano, bolide, etc.) non-nuclear explosion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Scale
Biggest accidental was the Halifax Explosion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halifax_Explosion
SHARKS (crossed out) MONGEESE (sic) WITH FRICKIN' LASER BEAMS ATTACHED TO THEIR HEADS

John
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Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Cambridge, MA USA
Contact:

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by John »

** 26-Dec-2021 World View: Non-nuclear explosions
Tom Mazanec wrote:
Sat Dec 25, 2021 11:15 pm
> It may be the 6th greatest accidental non-nuclear explosion
> in history, but I believe Minor Scale was the largest artificial
> (not volcano, bolide, etc.) non-nuclear explosion.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Sca ... dental was
> the Halifax Explosion
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halifax_Explosion
I went back to my original source:

-- Lebanon tensions test Hezbollah-Aoun alliance
https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-ea ... 021-10-18/
(Reuters, 18-Oct-2021)

It turns out that I misquoted it. The source refers to it as "one of
the largest non-nuclear explosions ever," which is consistent with
what you're saying. Thanks for the correction.

Navigator
Posts: 652
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Navigator »

Cool Breeze wrote:
Sat Dec 25, 2021 12:08 pm
This sounds like a universal message and warning to those in decline = similar things happen to all people who forget (don't remember) the one true God and what we are called to do as part of His assembly. In that sense, isn't this just a cycle of GD?
Yes, the history of the world is very cyclic. It seems to be part of God's design, which uses a lot of what John describes as GD.

Navigator
Posts: 652
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Navigator »

John wrote:
Sat Dec 25, 2021 1:50 pm
** 25-Dec-2021 World View: Isaiah 17:1-3 and the destruction of Damascus

One of the most interesting parts of Isaiah is Isaiah 17:1-3, which
predicts the destruction of Damascus:
> "1 The oracle concerning Damascus. "Behold, Damascus
> is about to be removed from being a city And will become a fallen
> ruin. 2 "The cities of Aroer are forsaken; They will be for flocks
> to lie down in, And there will be no one to frighten them. 3 "The
> fortified city will disappear from Ephraim, And sovereignty from
> Damascus And the remnant of Aram; They will be like the glory of
> the sons of Israel," Declares the LORD of hosts."
One of the big insights I got from Dr. Giliadi's research on Isaiah is that Isaiah is simultaneously talking about what is going on in his time (and his local geography - Egypt to Babylon) and what will take place in the world in the "end times". In doing so, each of the local geographic areas of his time serve as the example (stand in if you will) of an "end time" power or entity in the world.

For example, when Isaiah writes about Egypt, he is not just talking about the Egypt of his day, he is also talking about a worn out superpower of our day, most certainly the USA.

So, while Isaiah does talk about Damascus being "removed", he is talking BOTH about the fact that Damascus (capital of Aram, ally of Ephraim - the kingdom of the Northern 10 Tribes of Israel) will be taken by the Assyrians of his time and the people taken off into captivity (which is what happened), AND that a modern "Damascus" would also fall prey to a modern king of Assyria (the Anti-Christ).

In my thinking, modern "Damascus" is most likely Europe, which, like the kingdom of Ephraim, once had the gospel, but had mostly rejected it. Europe used to be Christian, but I wouldn't really characterize it that way today. It is mostly Materialistic and Atheistic.

Navigator
Posts: 652
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Restoration of Lost Truth

Post by Navigator »

I am going to continue now on the Theology theme and move the “last days” discussion over to that thread.

I posted about Isaiah because I believe his writings are among the most relevant to what we are about to go through.
God provided Isaiah with detailed information on Christ, his mortal mission, as well as the period before his return. This is because Isaiah was a prophet.

From the beginning, God provided mankind with detailed guidance through prophets. After Christ’s mortal ministry, he provided detailed and specific revelation through his Apostles (who were also prophets).

Amos 3:7
Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.

But, as I pointed out earlier, there was a loss of knowledge, as well as a cessation of revelation as the gospel was corrupted and the Apostles were lost.

That this would happen was also prophesied by the Apostles.

2 Thessalonians 2:parts 2-3
2 … the day of Christ is at hand.
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first…


Many think that God has ceased to speak to man, that he has said everything he is going to say, and that we have been on our own since the Bible was compiled. Personally, I do not believe this. If God is the same yesterday, today, and forever, he will continue to operate as he always has, through prophets.

In fact, I believe that this was foretold by his Apostles as well

Acts 3:21
Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

What I believe the Apostles were pointing to in this last verse is a restoration after a period of darkness. The darkness was when the pure gospel of Christ was not available, when there were no Apostles or Prophets, when the power to act in God’s name, the priesthood, was taken from the earth.
But after that darkness, the lost truths of the gospel would again be revealed by God through prophets. God would call such people, as he did in the Old Testament, and as Christ did in selecting his Apostles.

I believe that this restoration would need to take place in advance of Christ’s return. Because people would need to be given the opportunity to accept or reject the fulness of Christ’s gospel before he returns to the earth in judgement.

What I have written about so far in this thread are not just musings that I have personally had. I have written about lost truths that I believe have been restored in these, the last days prior to Christ’s return.

As before, I would urge anyone who has read what I have written in this thread, to think about it, and then to ask God in prayer if what I have written about is true or not. God will provide a witness to the truth, as long as someone is willing to accept it.

Cool Breeze
Posts: 1791
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:19 pm

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Cool Breeze »

John wrote:
Sat Dec 25, 2021 1:50 pm
** 25-Dec-2021 World View: Isaiah 17:1-3 and the destruction of Damascus

One of the most interesting parts of Isaiah is Isaiah 17:1-3, which
predicts the destruction of Damascus:
> "1 The oracle concerning Damascus. "Behold, Damascus
> is about to be removed from being a city And will become a fallen
> ruin. 2 "The cities of Aroer are forsaken; They will be for flocks
> to lie down in, And there will be no one to frighten them. 3 "The
> fortified city will disappear from Ephraim, And sovereignty from
> Damascus And the remnant of Aram; They will be like the glory of
> the sons of Israel," Declares the LORD of hosts."
Over the years, several people have written to me about this, to ask
whether it means that Damascus is going to be destroyed by a nuclear
bomb -- by Israel, by Iran, by Russia, by China, or by someone else.

One of the most complex comments that I received on this subject was
from a web site reader in February 2011, in response to my article
about the start of the "Arab Awakening" in Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, and
other countries:
> "I feel you are off in a few points. The biggest
> problem is you do not address the Bible's predictions in your
> assessments of a world conflict. As the Bible sees it, we shall
> have a limited war in the Middle East (Psalm 83/Isaiah 17/Jeremiah
> 49) that will involve Israel vs. Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, Egypt and
> Saudi Arabia. This war will end with Israel 'nuking' Damascus off
> the map and the world CRYING for a peace plan. With the inner ring
> of Arab nations conquered by Israel the Middle East problems will
> be seen as over, a 'new' global leader will provide a seven year
> treaty that makes more war impossible. Though when everyone says
> 'peace and safety', the end comes quickly. In 2-3 months I think,
> Russia and Iran and the outer ring of Arab nations will attack
> Israel in revenge (with Russia adding their might, but planning to
> double-cross the Arabs once things are done). ... As Ezekiel
> 38-39 reads God will supernaturally save Israel, and leave but
> 1/6th of its attackers alive."
The person who made these predictions ten years ago would undoubtedly
change many of the details today. Such are the dangers of trying to
make predictions, especially about the future. But one thing that
this commenter would almost certainly leave unchanged is the "nuking"
of Damascus.

Almost everyone in the Mideast seems to know about this prophecy. So
if anybody actually DOES drop a bomb on Damascus at some time in the
future, it will truly be a self-fulfilling prophecy, since the
attacker will certainly justify this action by saying it's a Bible
prophecy. Thus, it would be possible to argue that the CAUSE of the
nuclear attack on Damascus would have been the Bible prophecy. This
is ANOTHER danger of making predictions about the future -- someone
may make it his business to bring the prediction to pass.

Incidentally, the destruction of Damascus doesn't have to be from a
nuclear bomb. I'm thinking of the catastrophic seaport explosion in
Beirut on August 4, 2020 that leveled thousands of homes, killed and
injured thousands of people, and left 300,000 people homeless. Beirut
was, and still is, a city in ruins. That massive explosion was from
thousands of tonnes of ammonium nitrate that had been left in the port
since 2013. It is considered to be the greatest non-nuclear explosion
in history.
Very interesting post John. This coincides with the type of my current feeling on nuclear weapons, meaning that if they are used they will be regional and then a large outcry from how bad it is and looks will usher in a new (short) age of "global peace" led by a leader who will have many characteristics that also have been talked about, and are ultimately untrustworthy.

Cool Breeze
Posts: 1791
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:19 pm

Re: Religion / Theology

Post by Cool Breeze »

Navigator wrote:
Sun Dec 26, 2021 2:47 pm
John wrote:
Sat Dec 25, 2021 1:50 pm
** 25-Dec-2021 World View: Isaiah 17:1-3 and the destruction of Damascus

One of the most interesting parts of Isaiah is Isaiah 17:1-3, which
predicts the destruction of Damascus:
> "1 The oracle concerning Damascus. "Behold, Damascus
> is about to be removed from being a city And will become a fallen
> ruin. 2 "The cities of Aroer are forsaken; They will be for flocks
> to lie down in, And there will be no one to frighten them. 3 "The
> fortified city will disappear from Ephraim, And sovereignty from
> Damascus And the remnant of Aram; They will be like the glory of
> the sons of Israel," Declares the LORD of hosts."
One of the big insights I got from Dr. Giliadi's research on Isaiah is that Isaiah is simultaneously talking about what is going on in his time (and his local geography - Egypt to Babylon) and what will take place in the world in the "end times". In doing so, each of the local geographic areas of his time serve as the example (stand in if you will) of an "end time" power or entity in the world.

For example, when Isaiah writes about Egypt, he is not just talking about the Egypt of his day, he is also talking about a worn out superpower of our day, most certainly the USA.

So, while Isaiah does talk about Damascus being "removed", he is talking BOTH about the fact that Damascus (capital of Aram, ally of Ephraim - the kingdom of the Northern 10 Tribes of Israel) will be taken by the Assyrians of his time and the people taken off into captivity (which is what happened), AND that a modern "Damascus" would also fall prey to a modern king of Assyria (the Anti-Christ).

In my thinking, modern "Damascus" is most likely Europe, which, like the kingdom of Ephraim, once had the gospel, but had mostly rejected it. Europe used to be Christian, but I wouldn't really characterize it that way today. It is mostly Materialistic and Atheistic.
This is generally the approach I have as well. Sorta like how we all as humans are in the end times, since we don't know our time of death, and that's why the teaching is to always be vigilant. Of course, we don't do a good job of that, and thank God that He is merciful beyond all measure that we can contemplate, since we know we are nothing without Him.

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