Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

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Cool Breeze
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Re: Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

Post by Cool Breeze »

Exactly John, thanks for proving yet again that nearly everything these people state is demonstrably false, and what's worse, it's usually the exact opposite. Can you get any more wrong, over and over, with facts going against you and not have people call you insane or delusional? Again, the sane among us know that the insane (BB types) don't even make sense when they talk. They aren't worried about facts, logic, or conclusions. Just collective and chaotic critical theories that distract from the reality that all men aren't created equal, though we should treat them that way under the law. And we do.

The funniest part is that Bob can't and won't answer any of your objections. Let's be frank, if we want to talk about groups (and I don't want to, but idiots like Bob always do and that's the entire problem, as John states, they are the real racists) ... the fact is that whites do not benefit from blacks around, unless you count entertainment as the shining example or such things (civilizationally). The converse is not true, and is why so many third world people will literally die trying to get to european civilizations. Ironically, these are the civilizations that other subverters like Bob consider racist, although they fare much better there than in the shitholes they came from! Sounds like benevolence, the opposite of oppression.

You can't make this stuff up, it's irrefutable to boot. Another example of something Bobby B can't, and therefore won't, counter.

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Bob Butler
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Tribal Thinking and Covid???

Post by Bob Butler »

John wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 2:20 pm
Here's a typical conversation with you:

John says: 2+2=4

Butler says: 2+2=5. John was wrong because of tribal thinking.

That's all you can do.
From my perspective, when I say 2 + 2 = 4, the response is that my Spanish pronunciation is poor. Never mind that I haven’t posted in Spanish and don’t speak it. In my recent posting, I proposed that Republicans think in terms of prejudice, while Democrats think in term of principle. Democrats are for all men, Republicans for themselves and oppressing those they perceive of as different. The so called reply did not address Tribal Thinking, but was focused on the Covus virus. While the title called out Tribal Thinking as the center of the post, John cannot defend tribal thinking. It is centered on prejudice, oppression and violence. Those cultures where it still dominates are a mess for obvious reasons.

Instead the bulk of the article was about the virus. As far as I can tell there was one study where in severe cases involving ventilation there was a protocol of Hydrooxychloroquine and zinc that did help. That to me might indicate the zinc was the cause. Trump was not advocating the drug for the study population, but for everybody, along with drinking bleach. We wound up having one of the worst Covid responses in the world at the time. There is a long way from there to all Democrats are liars.

The quick confirmation of my opinion was on Wiki.
Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are anti-malarial medications also used against some auto-immune diseases. Chloroquine, along with hydroxychloroquine, was an early failed experimental treatment for COVID-19.[44] They are not effective for preventing infection.

Several countries initially used chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine for treatment of persons hospitalized with COVID‑19 (as of March 2020), though the drug was not formally approved through clinical trials. From April to June 2020, there was an emergency use authorization for their use in the United States, and was used off label for potential treatment of the disease. On 24 April 2020, citing the risk of "serious heart rhythm problems", the FDA posted a caution against using the drug for COVID‑19 "outside of the hospital setting or a clinical trial".

Their use was withdrawn as a possible treatment for COVID‑19 infection when it proved to have no benefit for hospitalized patients with severe COVID-19 illness in the international Solidarity trial and UK RECOVERY Trial. On 15 June, the FDA revoked its emergency use authorization, stating that it was "no longer reasonable to believe" that the drug was effective against COVID-19 or that its benefits outweighed "known and potential risks.” In fall of 2020, the National Institutes of Health issued treatment guidelines recommending against the use of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19 except as part of a clinical trial.
Now if you want to ignore the poor performance of the US against Covid during the Trump years, I can’t stop you. If you value biased newspaper articles over the FDA and CDC, I can’t stop you. If you want to take one study and run with it despite the limitations, I can’t stop you.

But none of that makes either red or blue folk liars. They just think differently. Reds center on their prejudices, blues on their principles. Abandoning one in favor of the other is not lying.

Counting on either side to abandon their way of thought is pretty futile. It happens only when forced to happen in a crisis by a disaster. It is headed to happen yet again.

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Re: Tribal Thinking and Covid???

Post by John »

Bob Butler wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 9:08 pm
> From my perspective, when I say 2 + 2 = 4, the response is that my
> Spanish pronunciation is poor. Never mind that I haven’t posted
> in Spanish and don’t speak it.
Are you off your meds?

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Bob Butler
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Re: Tribal Thinking and Covid???

Post by Bob Butler »

John wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 9:50 pm
Bob Butler wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 9:08 pm
From my perspective, when I say 2 + 2 = 4, the response is that my Spanish pronunciation is poor. Never mind that I haven’t posted in Spanish and don’t speak it.
Are you off your meds?
Nope. I did have my new blood sampler meter come in a few hours before the old one ran out of battery power, but I still had my old meter available. Doing well.

My post above was a metaphor about when you can’t defend yourself you change the subject. You chose not to defend tribal thinking. I figure that you can’t defend tribal thinking because there is no defense for it. Tribal thinking is forming your own supposedly outlaying group like the Aryan Supermen or the white supremicists, then inventing and collecting justifications for your prejudice to justify oppression, and violence. Defending this against principles like rule of law, equality and due process would be too humiliating. It isn’t as if it is hard to see who are the bad guys.

I watched a YouTube video on the untold turning point of the war in the Pacific. It reminded me of your telling of the Marco Polo bridge incident. There were two good ports in the area west of Guadalcanal, Rabul and Port Moresby. The Japanese had taken Rabul in their initial attack. The allies had beefed up the defenses of Port Moresby. The Japanese set up an elaborate two pronged attack on these defenses, neglecting to see how strong they were.

One of these prongs was detected by coast watchers and wiped out by superior daytime allied air. The planes did such a job taking out Japanese command, transport and communications that the other wave did not know the first had been taken out.

The other attack went well for a few days, led by two tanks opposed by a defense that had no anti tank weapons. Then came the prime attack, broad ways across a new half built runway. There was a prosaic description of one Japanese singer, who just before battle sang some glorious song to the emperor. This was repeated by the entire Japanese force. Elegant. Determined. They clearly believed themselves superior to any opposing force, and roused themselves to a glorious charge. If this were a American Idol style singing contest, maybe they were the better group.

But this wasn’t a remake of Zulu, or maybe it was. The Japanese charged across the open runway into dug in machine gun nests of the main Aussie defense. It went about as the rest of the Pacific war was going to go. If you hate enough, eventually you run into another culture who has an advanced and stubborn attitude and the firepower to back it up.

Building up prejudice, convincing yourself that your hated and was more deserving, wasn’t enough, any more than superior singing.

In a conflict of prejudice against principle, it is no different. But if stupidity is involved, it is in thinking the prejudiced side are the good guys. Things are not decided entirely by belief in your prejudices. Things like machine guns, nukes, proxy wars, insurgent wars, non violence and principle can get in the way of the most prejudiced.

I know you have visited web sites with other leanings than this one. I suspect you have seen how people cling to their worldviews. They don’t tend to change how they view things. This does not mean you can’t lie about what other people supposedly believe. If you wish to continue to believe in your own lies, I can’t stop you. But the failure to see that the world has changed makes it harder to believe that having the opposite worldview doesn’t make you stupid.

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Re: Tribal Thinking and Covid???

Post by John »

** 13-Jun-2021 World View: Defending Tribal Thinking
Bob Butler wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:32 pm
> My post above was a metaphor about when you can’t defend yourself
> you change the subject. You chose not to defend tribal thinking. I
> figure that you can’t defend tribal thinking because there is no
> defense for it. Tribal thinking is forming your own supposedly
> outlaying group like the Aryan Supermen or the white supremicists,
> then inventing and collecting justifications for your prejudice to
> justify oppression, and violence. Defending this against
> principles like rule of law, equality and due process would be too
> humiliating. It isn’t as if it is hard to see who are the bad
> guys.
I'm not a "tribal thinker." You are.

The mythical Cassandra was not a tribal thinker. The Biblical
Jeremiah was not a tribal thinker. I'm Cassandra and Jeremiah, not a
tribal thinker.

You and all the Democrats are "tribal thinkers," ever since the Civil
War, when you formed the KKK to rape young black girls and lynch young
black boys, and then after the KKK ended, adopted a policy to destroy
black families. These are pure tribal acts. And now your tribe is
led by Joe Biden who is a the worst White Supremacist president ever,
and with the release of Hunter's hate-filled tweets last week, we know
that the entire Biden family has a deep hatred for blacks, making them
the appropriate leaders of the Democrat Party tribe.

So of course I don't defend hate-filled "tribal thinking." Why should
I defend you?

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Bob Butler
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Two Principles, tribal thinking and the Cassandra complex

Post by Bob Butler »

You are correct that Cassandra and Jeremiah were not classic examples of tribal thinking. They did identify and associate with Troy and the Jews accordingly. However, their times were such that the two groups were not doing much oppressing. Troy and the Jews of the times were the ones oppressed by superior powers. The Greeks and Babylonians held the upper hand. People like Hitler, Napoleon, Attilla, the slaveowners or today’s white supremacists would better represent tribal thinking. If you want an example of tribal thinking, look for those who see their own group as superior, the rival group as inferior, and practice intimidation, subjugation and violence against the other group.

Working for principles such as equality and rule of law would be the opposite.

The Cassandra complex is how you seem to see yourself. This requires accurately foretelling the future, but no one being willing to listen. This is even as you have collected a following that does listen. The two concepts - tribal thinking and the Cassandra complex - are entirely different. Disproving one concept or showing it does not apply does not effect the other.

The question is whether you can accurately foretell the future of the current S&H crisis conservatively and bind to S&H turning theory at the same time. In every crisis to date in the Anglo American sequence, the progressive side and values came to dominate. Kings fell, slaves were freed, dictators removed from power, economies regulated, etc…. Old flaws in Agricultural and Industrial Age thinking are removed. The progressives are looking to dominate again. Thus, perceiving yourself as fitting in with Cassandra, Jeremiah, Strauss and Howe together seems absurdly premature and contra productive. You are just projecting your worldview forward. Others disagree with you for good reason.

Mind you, some areas of the world are still dominated by tribal thinking. Some modern thinkers don’t seem to properly understand, and make some pretty silly predictions. But you see tribal thinking areas - centered on self interest, prejudice and oppression - are a mess. But when you look at full scale crises and how they are resolved, you can’t claim the Cassandra complex. The progressives side winds up ahead.

Again you are sticking with a false version of history. The political parties switched allegiance on race when LBJ allied with MLK and Nixon responded with the southern strategy. Whenever you contradict actual history with your biased daydreams, any objective audience will disregard what you say. This has nothing to do with the Cassandra effect, everything to do with blindingly obvious ideological bias.

The closing sentence doesn’t parse, so no comment.

Cool Breeze
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Re: Tribal Thinking and Covid???

Post by Cool Breeze »

John wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 6:16 pm
So of course I don't defend hate-filled "tribal thinking." Why should
I defend you?
Do you think he believes stealing elections is "progressive"?

One of the reasons why leftists make so little sense is because they are always lying about issues and using language that has been manipulated to render it meaningless ... but confuse others along the way. They are spiritually devoid, just like their father - of the true spirit, that is.

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Bob Butler
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Stealing Elections

Post by Bob Butler »

I don’t care much of what John supposedly ‘thinks’, but stealing elections or voter fraud can be done by either party. The Republicans held a violent insurrection to attempt to stop the 2020 due process, and are at the state level suppressing voters. They have been fond of Gerrymandering. At the moment, the Republicans are more into stealing elections as they have no majority nation wide and need to cheat to win. If you have a majority, if the election demographics are on your side, you can put on your plastic halo and pretend to be the good guys. Who knows, maybe they are? Through much of the recent unraveling the Democrats lost lots of elections without using the sort of tricks the Republicans are resorting to today. Thus, the Republicans are voter suppressing at the state level in states they control, while the Democrats are pushing voter rights at the federal level.

During the Jim Crow time the Democrats prevented blacks from voting, but this was again the rural racist faction. Different party, same sort of people, more fond of racism than democracy.

I wouldn’t call stealing elections part of the modern progressive agenda, but I’m sure you could find both parties doing it somewhere in history. The hotly contested election of 1876 that in the end put Rutherford Hayes in as the 19th president is a good place to look.

Quote some examples on the lying thing. I can’t counter vague broad generalizations. Today, though, the Republicans are much into the Big Lie. Politicians lie. Maybe you could find examples.

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Re: Polyticks: Bob Butler's Perspective

Post by John »

** 18-Jun-2021 World View: Jackass Butler

Hi Jackass:

What the hell is this all about:
> Report details
> Report reason: Warez
>
> Reported by Bob Butler « Fri Jun 18, 2021 6:54 pm
> This user is promoting criminal action and should b banned.
Are you saying I should ban myself? What a jackass you are.

You're referring to the site where you can watch Fox News for free:

https://watchnewslive.tv/fox-news-live-stream-usa/

I checked it out, and it's not illegal.

Maybe you should watch Fox News for a while, and then you might learn
how not to be a total White Supremacist Jackass.

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Bob Butler
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Liar John

Post by Bob Butler »

John wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 9:09 pm
What the hell is this all about:
> Report details
> Report reason: Warez
>
> Reported by Bob Butler « Fri Jun 18, 2021 6:54 pm
> This user is promoting criminal action and should b banned.
Are you saying I should ban myself? What a jackass you are.

You're referring to the site where you can watch Fox News for free:

https://watchnewslive.tv/fox-news-live-stream-usa/

I checked it out, and it's not illegal.
In the aftermath of the January 6th violent insurrection, the government tried to prevent the use of social media to plan criminal acts. I'm not impressed. It might have felt good, but the internet is such that it only drove the bad guys further underground, made it harder to listen in on what they were planing, The conservatives attempted to redefine it as an attempt to limit political speech. Did you ever hear of the government trying to limit political speech? Admittedly, the people here are not much into criminal action - they are big on talk slow on action - but it was an issue once upon a time.

Taking benefits intended for veterans is as close as I've noticed to conservatives promoting improper action. Now this seems important only if you have integrity. I have not noticed your having that. But if you are fine with folks taking benefits intended only to veterans, go ahead. What conservative cares about integrity?

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