Abortion

[John]

Sunday, February 5th, 2023.

well, this is interesting. Pope Francis has just declared that homosexuality is not a sin. My mother would be very contemptuous of this decision by the Catholic Church. I wonder if it's still a sin to use contraceptives?

[Bob Butler]

https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print ... t-abortion

You do not consider a zygote to be a neighbor. Hitler did not consider Jews his neighbors. So you wish to deny humans the freedom from murder in the first nine months of their life. Maybe that makes you one of the too many bad guys?

I can come up with a definition of sapient which the mother could easily pass and the fetus not. Either the reason or self aware tests mentioned already would do. Hitler could not do the same with Jews. This obvious fact counters most of the arguments in your post. You love cells but not mothers. You would force your culture on others not of your culture.

Anyway, I will continue to take the women’s vote over the religious fanatic vote. If you must side with Hitler, you must.

[Tom Mazanec]

I love all women and am trying to save their souls. And you are trying to force your culture on me and the preborn babies.

[Bob Butler]

well, this is interesting. Pope Francis has just declared that homosexuality is not a sin. My mother would be very contemptuous of this decision by the Catholic Church. I wonder if it's still a sin to use contraceptives?

I am becoming convinced that harming others is a sin. Does a homosexual act harm anyone? The abortion question seems to devolve into whether one counts a fetus as a person or not. Can you define the fetus as having a property uniquely human or sentient? Someday, sure. But what property does the fetus actually have which makes it sentient? With homosexuals, Jews, blacks, or name your form of prejudice, It is fairly clear. All are sentient and being harmed. At any rate, using contraceptives doesn’t seem to hurt others. Still, there is no lack of people who prefer to impose their own culture on others.

[Bob Butler]

I love all women and am trying to save their souls. And you are trying to force your culture on me and the preborn babies.

If you loved women you would give them freedom rather than try to impose your culture on them. Do you have scientific evidence for the existence of souls, or is that just another Catholic lie? Can a non sapient thing have a culture? That last maybe. Two wolf packs in different environments could develop quite different behaviors. I don't see that in a fetus.

[John]

Sunday, February 5th, 2023

My mother felt that the Greek Orthodox Church was superior to the Catholic Church because the latter lacked discipline. it used to be the case that it was a sin to eat meat on Friday. in both the Greek Orthodox Church and the Catholic church. My mother was very contemptuous of the decision by the Catholic church, I believe it was in the 1950s, to allow eating meat on Friday. My mother believed that the Catholic church was inferior because it changed its rules according to popular pressure, which is how she viewed the decision to permit eating meat on Friday. she would view. Pope Francis:s decision that homosexuality is not a sin in the same way.

[Bob Butler]

My mother felt that the Greek Orthodox Church was superior to the Catholic Church because the latter lacked discipline. it used to be the case that it was a sin to eat meat on Friday. in both the Greek Orthodox Church and the Catholic church. My mother was very contemptuous of the decision by the Catholic church, I believe it was in the 1950s, to allow eating meat on Friday. My mother believed that the Catholic church was inferior because it changed its rules according to popular pressure, which is how she viewed the decision to permit eating meat on Friday. she would view. Pope Francis:s decision that homosexuality is not a sin in the same way.

Yes, if you believe you have a channel to the on high, and the on high never changes, a change in position becomes a flaw. This clashes with turning theory which says to expect a massive cultural change every four score and seven years. I can see your mother’s attitude, but recognizing and pursing growth and change has its points too. The Agricultural Age was a mess. We had to grow out of it. It is hard to grow while considering yourself perfect and moving with your base.

[John]

a church is not a democracy.

[Bob Butler]

a church is not a democracy.

Clearly. I can see the Agricultural Age as having many flaws, only some of which have been fixed, while new flaws have become apparent to those who are willing to see. Some see God as reflecting an ideal that cannot and should not be changed. As an engineering major and Christian Fellowship member, I looked to learn under what condition God suspended the laws that Newton and others discovered. I found my answers in parapsychology experiments. Others look in other places, and find different things.

This has me wondering. Does what you find depend on where you look? If your worldview is religious, and your God does not change, will you not see a growing changing culture? If you are asking religious or science, and you use parapsychology as a way of seeking, are you leaning towards science already?

[JCP]

a church is not a democracy.

Nor should it be. The Catholic Church along with the other watered-down mainstream Protestant churches are now breaking apart. It is the evangelical and orthodox churches--even the Muslims--who benefit and move forward. In France, it is Catholic churches being purchased and turned into mosques. In England, the Anglican ones (but not until after hosting a few pornographic fashion shows) that are becoming mosques and private homes.

People want moral absolutes, not moral relativism.

Pope Francis is the worst Pope in history. So far.