Financial topics

Investments, gold, currencies, surviving after a financial meltdown
Higgenbotham
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Re: Financial topics

Post by Higgenbotham »

browner55 wrote:I have been scratching my head to the point of making it bleed with respect to the bond market and the Fed's recent involvement in same. I am a deflationist but this guy's analysis is interesting:

The Fed's Bubble Trouble

Peter Schiff
Jan 10, 2009
The Fed and the banks (along with their "affiliates") are playing musical chairs (or poker if you prefer) with the debts. The debts have been repackaged and moved around. Debt by any other name (such as money) is still debt. And debt has been repackaged and moved around and renamed as money instead of an asset. And so on. To think of it another way, if all the debt can be put into a big blender and rehomogenized so that it is all equally crappy again then in some sense it might all end up being good (that process has already been done once--it was called securitization, derivatives, MBS, CDO, etc.). Or it might all collapse at once. Can that be done and will it be done? Well, to my way of thinking they aren't very far along in the process and some of the debt already stinks, so nobody wants it except the Fed and, as we can see from recent headlines, that stench is spreading. But if they can do it, then yes, US Treasury Bonds just fall to the level of the whole homogenized mess, with minimal stratification. But that's what we already had at the top of the bubble, so the economy has to be "rebubbleized" too in order to pull that off. In other words, brain implants might be required to get everyone into the proper psychological state. If they can keep all of these debts afloat and create even more new ones, then Schiff will be right and there will be inflation or hyperinflation. I'd like to see mannfm11 weigh in on this one, but if he doesn't it seems like his old posts say essentially the same thing.

You know, the "experts" on the markets have to sell something if they can't make their living trading the markets. A lot of them sell newsletters. Many become brokers. If you have inflation hedges to broker, then you want to convince yourself that there will be inflation. Not too many people can make a living selling government debt when it is sold directly through treasury direct commission free. So there's not much of an industry out there convincing people there will be deflation because there's no money to be made in it. You can ask John how rich and famous he got saying there would be deflation and he will probably tell you. That's maybe an illustration of why the first chapter of The Fourth Turning is called "Winter Comes Again."
While the periphery breaks down rather slowly at first, the capital cities of the hegemon should collapse suddenly and violently.
freddyv
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Re: Financial topics

Post by freddyv »

The earnings debacle starts anew:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Alcoa-rep ... 34634.html

"Alcoa's loss of $1.49 cents per share highlighted the impact of the weakening world economy on key aluminum markets, including construction and autos. It earned $632 million, or 75 cents per share, in the year-ago period.

Revenue fell 6.6 percent to $5.7 billion.

Analysts estimated a loss of 10 cents per share on revenue of $5.26 billion, excluding special charges totaling $920 million, or $1.15 per share."
Once again these predictions are shown to be completely useless...but entertaining. :-)

We're already at about -15% according to Thomson/Reuters, anyone want to take a guess at the final number for the quarter? I'll pick -32%.

--Fred
sunay
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Re: Financial topics

Post by sunay »

Hi John the following is an extract of your comments on Obama's speech.

"Just take one example: Oil. America imports millions of barrels of oil every day, paying for it with dollars borrowed from China by selling them Treasuries. When China's financial crisis becomes so bad that they will be unable to purchase any more Treasuries, then America will no longer be able to purchase oil. In fact, that's probably the point at which the American government will go into default, and outstanding Treasuries will be marked down to a fraction of their previous values.

Meanwhile, on main street, there'll be little heating oil available to heat homes, and there'll be little gasoline available to run cars.

I suppose the ironic result will be that Obama will then agree to use some of fiscal stimulus money to drill for oil offshore, and in Alaska."


I have to admit I am a little bit surprised that you talk about US going into default and at the same time that deflation is going to move up the USD 's value against other currencies...
I might have misread something...thank you for your insight
John
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Re: Financial topics

Post by John »

sunay wrote: I have to admit I am a little bit surprised that you talk about US going into default and at the same time that deflation is going to move up the USD 's value against other currencies...
I might have misread something...thank you for your insight
Because when you owe money in US dollars, and US dollars gain in value
relative to other currencies, then you owe more and more money.

John
John
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Re: Financial topics

Post by John »

Higgenbotham wrote:You can ask John how rich and famous he got saying there would be deflation and he will probably tell you.
I hear that Steven Spielberg is planning a "Generational Dynamics" movie.

I wonder who he's casting to play me?

John
Higgenbotham
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Koo's Analysis

Post by Higgenbotham »

John,

I read your blog entry on Koo's analysis tonight. I made an offhand comment the other day that Koo's analysis addressed cash flow and assumed everything else would take care of itself. Then I mentioned that demographics and productivity are important factors to consider.

His basic premise seems to be one of maintaining constant GDP where

GDP = Household Spending + Government Spending

Household Spending = Household Income - Household Savings

As Household Savings increase, Household Spending (or Household Contribution Towards GDP) decreases by an equal amount.

Therefore, assuming that the increase in Government Spending is equal to the increase in Household Savings, then Household Income must remain the same or increase to maintain GDP.

Demographics and productivity both correlate with household income. Demographics because they impact the percentage of working age population and productivity because it correlates positively with income. Therefore, any government spending programs must not have a negative long term effect on productivity, and productivity must also maintain its natural increase or at least remain constant overall.

A second potential issue I see with Koo's analysis is that it looks at overall cash flows to the economy but neglects company specific effects and the fact that consumers spend differently than governments. Therefore, there can still be default risk to specific companies as consumer behavior changes and government spending is directed into other areas. As a result, the possible systemic effects of credit derivative defaults still remain.

I listened to the whole 1.5 hour presentation and those are the things I saw just off the top of my head.
While the periphery breaks down rather slowly at first, the capital cities of the hegemon should collapse suddenly and violently.
Higgenbotham
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Re: Financial topics

Post by Higgenbotham »

John wrote:
Higgenbotham wrote:You can ask John how rich and famous he got saying there would be deflation and he will probably tell you.
I hear that Steven Spielberg is planning a "Generational Dynamics" movie.

I wonder who he's casting to play me?

John
You're too much! I guess Steven Spielberg lost so much in the Madoff default that he had to lower his sights and cast Peter Schiff because you were in so much demand that he couldn't afford you.
While the periphery breaks down rather slowly at first, the capital cities of the hegemon should collapse suddenly and violently.
John
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Re: Koo's Analysis

Post by John »

Higgenbotham wrote: > Therefore, any government spending programs must not have a
> negative long term effect on productivity, and productivity must
> also maintain its natural increase or at least remain constant
> overall.
One pundit today said that the Mayor of Harrisburg, PA, has proposed
building two new hotels in Harrisburg from bailout money. These would
put other hotels out of business in the area. This story is
unconfirmed, but it's quite believable.

The more I hear about what's going on, the more I see the fiscal
stimulus "plan" as being developed by bunch of kindergarten kids in a
candy story.

John
Higgenbotham
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Re: Financial topics

Post by Higgenbotham »

Ben Bernanke's speech at the London School of Economics today:

http://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevent ... 90113a.htm
Particularly pressing is the need to address the problem of financial institutions that are deemed "too big to fail." It is unacceptable that large firms that the government is now compelled to support to preserve financial stability were among the greatest risk-takers during the boom period. The existence of too-big-to-fail firms also violates the presumption of a level playing field among financial institutions. In the future, financial firms of any type whose failure would pose a systemic risk must accept especially close regulatory scrutiny of their risk-taking. Also urgently needed in the United States is a new set of procedures for resolving failing nonbank institutions deemed systemically critical, analogous to the rules and powers that currently exist for resolving banks under the so-called systemic risk exception.
John posted some quotes from Obama's recent speech that were tending toward the attitudes expressed by FDR in his first Fireside Chat. I find Bernanke's words shocking in their strong repudiation of practices that were considered highy acceptable only months ago.

He also spends several paragraphs addressing the funding facilities for commercial paper and money market funds that I have been discussing here for the last week, prospects for inflation, and other issues.
While the periphery breaks down rather slowly at first, the capital cities of the hegemon should collapse suddenly and violently.
John
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A credit card without payback.

Post by John »

From a web site reader:
> Either you have misunderstood Mr Koo or I have misunderstood what
> you have written. You may or may not wish to alter your text based
> upon this comment:

> Mr Koo is not suggesting a "credit card without payback" at
> all. What he is suggesting is that massive government intervention
> in various forms will enable the USA economy to rebuild itself in
> recessionary conditions rather than fall into depression which
> makes rebuilding even harder. All the debt has to be repaid, by
> businesses, banks, private individuals, etc. The recession will
> last a long time while all this takes place, as it did in Japan.
Actually, that is exactly what he's suggesting.

What you're saying is technically correct. Obviously, all debts have
to be repaid eventually.

But when he said, "No worries!", he was saying, "No worries about
repaying the debt." His presentation clearly gives the impression
that there's no need to repay the debt for 30 years, since crisis
survivors will be paying down debt for at least that long. And
telling a politician that he can spend as much money as he wants, and
won't have to worry about repaying it for 30 years is equivalent to
telling him that he has a "credit card without payback."
> I am separately emailing you the Reinhart and Rogoff presentation
> of 3 January 2009 to the American Economic Association. Upwaited
> Government spending is standard global practice in recessionary
> conditions, Koo has simply focused upon certain Japanese issues
> which he feels are applicable to the USA. The sting in the tail of
> course is the debt!

> I do think your point about global recession now versus when Japan
> applied the strategy is "on the button". I am in no doubt that
> Japan was substantially saved by its exports, and indirect exports
> i.e. Japanese companies setting up manufacturing businesses in
> low wage South East Asian countries (including manufacturing joint
> ventures in China in those days) and repatriating the export
> profits.
I agree with you that debt repayment is the issue, and I also agree
with your implication that the tail is going to "sting" much, much
sooner than 30 years from now.

Sincerely,

John
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