guest wrote: ↑Wed Jul 24, 2024 11:00 am
Navigator wrote: ↑Tue Jul 23, 2024 11:04 pm
thinker wrote: ↑Mon Jul 22, 2024 10:40 pm
Navigator, Romney would be a horrible candidate and would get destroyed. The regular everyday working class can't stand him. Would Romney be better than Harris or Newsome? The answer to that is yes, but that is an insanely low bar to beat.
The vast majority of people don't want either extreme, which is now Trump / Harris. They want a "middle road", be it a Romney or a Manchin. Either would win in a landslide versus Trump or Harris.
The point was that the Dems could guarantee all Dem votes, two thirds (or more) of independents, and a third of Republicans if they went with Romney.
Most republican voters (Trump supporters) believe that democrat politicians and most republican politicians are corrupt and controlled (by money, blackmail, big pharma, defense, intel agencies, etc), and don't trust them. This includes Romney. Republican voters mostly hate him.
Trump made his fortune then got into politics, which theoretically makes him less susceptible to corruption. This is the opposite of Biden, Pelosi, Obama, and lots of republicans who made it into government, then got impossibly rich.
Trump was worth $3.9B before taking office and was worth $3.0B when he left. Also he's lucky to be alive now and if he were "in it for himself", he would've left the race a long time ago.
That's why his supporters voted for him and will continue to do so.
I agree with you that most politicians (Rep and Dem) are crooked and many are controlled by outside interests.
As a conservative, I would love to have a hero with great values come to the rescue. Unfortunately, Trump is not that guy. Here is what I have written on Trump and his supposed business success in the past (note that this doesn't include my take on his personally repugnant morals):
Trump as Politician (2016)
Trump is a real estate magnate from New York City. He borrowed billions for projects and then enriched himself in a shell game that left the banks holding the bag when the loans came due. He then converted over to selling his name and persona. His method of success is not to create, but to enrich himself at the expense of others. Personally, he is a thin skinned bully who says the most outrageously egotistical things. On top of this are his misogynistic statements that are an affront to any female.
The Trump Business Model (2017)
Donald Trump professes to be one of the best businessmen in existence. A large part of his presidential campaign and appeal to voters was that Trump, by becoming financially successful, learned how to successfully operate a large business, and that this would translate to successful political leadership. So what is Trump’s business? How did he run it? And what are the implications for all of us now that he has moved from business to political leadership?
Trump started out in New York City refurbishing old hotels and building new ones. Before he did so, he got “tax abatements” from the city for what he was to build. This meant that the properties would not be taxed for forty years. So, he got $400 Million from the city (over the 40 years no tax was collected) for a hotel it cost him $120 Million to build.
This is how Trump constructed and profited from his initial Manhattan property empire. He was guided and aided by none other than Roy Cohn, the infamous Senator McCArthy attorney, who later represented most of the heads of New York’s mafia families.
He then became a big player in Atlantic City, building Trump Plaza and then Trump Castle. He then went too far, borrowing and bonding heavily to build the Taj Mahal. This last casino was so big, and required so much debt to build, that Trump couldn’t afford the interest payments (let alone payments to construction contractors). At this point, banks stopped lending him additional funds. So he went public. He sold stock in “Trump Hotels & Casino Resorts”. Around the same time, he moved all of the personal and company debt he could into the already over-leveraged Taj Mahal.
Years ago, I played a computer game called “Railroad Tycoon”. After some experience, I found that there was a foolproof way to win the game every time. You started off the game owning one of many different rail lines, let’s call it “MyRR”. To win, the best strategy was to take control of a faltering competitor, call it “SadRR”. Once you controlled SadRR, you would have them borrow all the money that banks would lend them. You then transferred the borrowed funds from SadRR to MyRR. Then you had SadRR declare bankruptcy. The banks could only go after SadRR, as that is who borrowed the money. MyRR pocketed a windfall.
Trump developed a similar business model, using the Taj Mahal as “SadRR”. Money was transferred from the public company to other Trump owned entities, by paying for goods and services. A company or a hotel doesn’t have to prove that it has hired the best supplier or the best management firm, and it pays those it chooses what they ask. This way Trump was able to get out from under mountains of debt, yet leaving his investors and contractors in ruin.
In the end, the banks stopped lending to Trump properties and projects. They had been burned too many times. But Trump had been doing something else during the 1980’s and 90’s. He had been making himself famous. He became known for wealth and opulence, among other things.
So when he could borrow no more, he changed his business model. Instead of building a project himself, he leased his NAME to others. This way he did not have to borrow, or even build the project. While those doing so branded it a “Trump Property” by paying him for the use of his name.
Evidently, many of the people paying for his name are doing so for nefarious purposes. In the old days, mobsters would launder their money from illegal operations (gambling, prostitution) through restaurants. It was impossible to tell how much a restaurant was really bring in, as it used to be a cash business. Mobsters could then say that their money came from their “restaurant business”. Real Estate is a much better way to launder money. A lot more money is involved in the construction, sale, and re-sale of real estate than in the operation of an eatery.
I don’t believe that Trump is any kind of super successful businessman. I think that he figured out how to game the system, nothing more. He has produced little of anything of lasting value. He is, however, a master showman. He showed very early on that he knows how to get his name in the media and keep it there. He knows how to work a crowd. And he knows how to tell people things they want to hear. So he’s a very good politician.
Conclusions
Trump is just as crooked as any other politician. He is in politics for himself. Just as most politicians are.
I don't believe Trump's word on his personal worth. Note that he could not post the funds required by the Civil Case that he lost. Note also that banks will not lend anything to Trump, as he has burned them too often.
Trump is now in the race to get revenge. Revenge against those that didn't buy into his story of the last election being stolen (and that includes numerous republicans and conservatives), revenge against those that have attacked him in court (and I have to agree that the NY case was spurious in that no underlying crime - the basis for the case - existed), and revenge against those that hate him to the point that they compromised his physical security and have made physical threats against him (and in this he is actually justified).
The CRUCIAL point in all of this is that we have to ALWAYS look at the facts and draw logical conclusions. REGARDLESS of whether we "like" or "dislike" the person involved or their politics.
BOTH SIDES, Democrat and Republican, have failed and continue to fail the country and the American people.
We have not had a great American president since Eisenhower. We aren't going to get a good one again anytime soon. At least not by the processes both corrupt parties have engineered to deprive the American people of a desirable alternative .